Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (Full Version)

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PTLA -> Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 7, 2008 5:49:21 PM)

I practice in outpatient orthopedics and have different ortho courses throughout my years of practice (McKenzie, Maitland, Elvey, Institute of Physical Art, NorthEast Seminars, etc.). In my quest to improve my knowledge and to stay current with practice, I'm getting concerned about wasting my time and money on courses that are just so-so.

How do I find great (the BEST, meaning most informative, up-to-date, effective, efficient) continuing education courses without wasting my time or money?



jma -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 7, 2008 10:03:22 PM)

I pay attention to those course that have evidenced-based information in their course description. This is where www.evidenceinmotion.com is really helpful. I would start with that and if in doubt, email the instructor if the information is up to date and evidenced based, then that would be a start.



PTLA -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 7, 2008 11:40:45 PM)

Have you taken any of the courses promoted by evidence in motion? If so, how do they compare w/other courses that you've taken?



jma -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 8, 2008 9:27:43 AM)

I have taken one of them in the past and it the handout was loaded with resources from the literature. Compared to other courses that I have taken in the past, they were not mentioned. Too bad that there are not many of them out there like it. However, the hands on lab was very basic.



TexasOrtho -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 8, 2008 11:33:07 AM)

I would highly recommend the IAOM (International Academy of Orthopedic Medicine) series.  They have about 12 courses from spinal to extremity management.  If you are wanting a very in depth course on anatomy, pathoanatomy, and systematic assessment, these are very comprehensive and worth the money.

Be ready to be a little overloaded by the 3rd day of the courses!



jma -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 8, 2008 2:15:48 PM)

Thanks for the tip.



jma -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 8, 2008 7:15:01 PM)

A residency program would be good to go to as well.



PTupdate.com -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 8, 2008 10:03:49 PM)

Just this past weekend, I took a course from SportsMedicine of Atlanta, titled “ Advanced Pain Assessment, Medical Screening and Biomechanical Differential Diagnosis for Physical Therapists”, taught by Robert DuVall PT, DHSc, MMSc, ATC, OCS, FAAOMPT, MTC, PCC, CSCS

Those who are familiar with me know I really despise most CEU courses, considering them a big waste of time, and stretching out 3 hours of material to two full days to justify a revenue stream.  This course was actually different, although it still could be condensed somewhat.

I needed this course to help with my Direct Access renewal due at the end of 2008, and I have to admit I learned and relearned quite a bit.  Bob was a good speaker, and kept things rolling.  I purchased a CD-ROM from him with more info and forms to use, and plan on taking more from this guy, something I don't think has ever happened in my 17 year career!!!?!?!?!?!?!



PTLA -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 9, 2008 1:49:05 AM)

Thank you everyone for your feedback. I am also interested in taking courses that include a holistic approach to the patient which may include environmental causes, nutrition, visceral organs, etc. Does anybody have any experience with Center for Integrative Manual Therapy, etc., and effectiveness?



PTLA -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 9, 2008 1:57:58 AM)

John:

The course you mentioned sounds great. I'm going to check out the website and course description to get more info.

I completely agree with you that a lot of courses stretch out their material and is unnecessary. However, I have noticed that Cross Country University seems to condense their info into one-day seminars and try to give you the biggest bang for the buck. Have you taken any of their courses? If so, which courses have you completed and what is your opinion of them?

It seems to me that you've taken a lot of courses in your career, and so I'm curious to know which courses do you highly recommend and which ones do you think are a waste of time? I'm also interested in taking Kinesiotaping since I've heard some good things about it. Have you taken any IAOM or Evidence in Motion courses?

Thanks for your feedback!



PTupdate.com -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 9, 2008 8:33:29 AM)

I have taken two from CC seminars...the first was a one day program on manipulation, the second on vestibular rehab.  Both were good for being just one day, but the manip lab sessions ended up being a bunch of PT's trying to show all the others all the fancy things they can do........the PT version of plummage.

CC has one coming up that I wanted to attend, covering constraint induced therapy for stroke patients.  I have been encouraged by what I have read,and wanted to learn more.

I took a kinesiotaping course through NovaCare years back.  I learned some good stuff, but again it could have been condensed into 4 hours instead of 2 days.  I was suffering scapular pain at that time due to C7 nerve encroachment and damage, so certainly enjoyed the relief the tape provided in the lab sessions.  The position of sitting in a hotel conference table (along with bleachers) just kills my neck.



Tom Reeves DPT ATC -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 9, 2008 11:50:38 AM)

John, how did you go about treating the carpal tunnel you probably developed typing all of the initials behind Mr Duvall's name?

I personally have enjoyed the two Richard Jackson seminars, very evidence based spine/pelvis, and Lower quarter eval and treat courses.  My favorite is the Gary Gray Chain Reaction courses.  I have been to several.  His are loosely evidence based but more of a philosophical approach to "how" to think about things.  Very biomechanically oriented and very, very fulfilling professionally.  I can honestly say that between those two courses, i have changed my practice dramatically from what I learned in PT school. 



apolipo -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 10, 2008 8:12:01 AM)

I agree w/ Tom on his Gary Gray comments.  His course was a major transition point in my career.  It has been 4 years since I went and I would like to go back.  Granted, you won't find many literature references at this course, but he is not giving you any hocus pocus.  It's good old fashioned biomechanics, with a healthy dose of neuro, viewed through Gary's frame of reference.

I would also suggest Shirley Sahrmann courses at Washington University in St. Louis.  They are doing a lot of research at the moment to validate the Movement System Impairment model.  Her courses will teach you to look at human movement in a different way.

Mike T



ptim -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 10, 2008 8:46:45 AM)

How much McKenzie have you done?
i would highly recommend credentialling and/or going through the diploma program



Sebastian Asselbergs -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 10, 2008 10:17:11 AM)

PTLA, don not forget that IF you can get in with David Butler in one of his "Sensitive nervous system" workshops, you will learn a lot, laugh a lot and see some ortho-issues in a different light. well worth the money. 



PTLA -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 11, 2008 12:45:00 AM)

Thanks, John, for your input regarding courses you've taken.
Which courses would you say would be your top 10?



PTLA -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 11, 2008 12:48:27 AM)

Tom/Mike:

What is Gary Gray's "frame of reference?" Is he mostly exercise-based?

Mike:

I saw Shirley do a brief lecture at a Perform Better conference. Her stuff seemed interesting, but not sure it was going to be very helpful. How has it helped the way you practice?



PTLA -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 11, 2008 12:50:33 AM)

ptim:

I have done McKenzie Courses A-D. Great framework for evaluation and treatment, but have found it somewhat limiting. Therefore, my quest for more info...



PTLA -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 11, 2008 12:51:36 AM)

Sebastian:

Thanks for the tip.



apolipo -> RE: Is it just me or do other PTs have this problem? (June 11, 2008 8:47:10 AM)

Gary Gray's "frame of reference" is function.  What does this muscle need to do?  What is that joint supposed to do?  What is supposed to be helping?  Is the helper distal or proximal?  Is the helper right next door or is it more distant?  He was working on the "butt & gut" before most of us had heard the term.

Think back to a pt. that looked like this: older middle-aged male, blue collar, large upper body and barrel-chested.  Has chronic shoulder problems/RCT/surgical procedures.  Did he have a butt?  I can think back to several pts. who did not seem to lack upper body strength and size but had no hips & legs to match it.  During everyday tasks, the shoulders were always compensating for lazy hips.

Regarding Sahrmann, the main thing I pulled from her courses was a greater appreciation of human movement and how abnormal patterns can lead to musculoskeletal issues.  Her method involves an in-depth analysis of how a pt. moves.  Much like Gary Gray, the cause of the pain may be very different than the source of the pain.  There is a great deal of focus on the ability to control (rather than stabilize) the pelvis.

Surprisingly, Gary and Shirley's methods look very different but at their core have some of the same basic principles.  Movement is good, but everyone should contribute their fair share.  The cause of the pain is often not the source of the pain.

Mike T



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