|
|
TENS electrode placement
|
Logged in as: Guest
|
|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
TENS electrode placement - June 19, 2002 6:20:00 PM
|
|
|
sarty
Posts: 65
Joined: April 22, 2001
From: Florida, USA
Status: offline
|
I was told today by a PT in my clinic that 'cross placement' of electrodes with TENS (pulsed current) would cause the currents to "cancel each other out". He says the electrodes should be placed parallel, but not crossed. He said it was fine to cross the interferential electrodes because the AC current was modulated.
Okay, color me stupid, but I was taught that it was fine to do either parallel or cross placement with TENS. I understood what he was saying in general...that the pulsed currents would theoretically all 'hit' in the same place and disrupt the flow......however, if the circuit was truly interuppted, then no electricity would flow, right?
He has been in school more recently than I have, but I wanted to know what the general concensus is on this (assuming, of course, that TENS is effective for pain, which is a different thread altogether, rofl) [IMG]http://www.rehabedge.com/forums/wink.gif[/IMG]
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 19, 2002 9:08:00 PM
|
|
|
Bournephysio
Posts: 586
Joined: April 25, 2002
From: Calgary
Status: offline
|
Warning. Its late and I've been crunching 3d kinematics all day.
Tell them: If the electrodes of the two channels are placed at pi/2 radians the currents will be orthogonal and linearly independant and thus will not add or subtract.
basically says if they are at 90 degrees they can't interfere. I'm not an electrical engineer so I'm not 100% sure thats true.
In my view tens effects are from sensory and motor nerve stim. The vast majority of this is going to be near the electrodes where the current density is the largest.
In other words it doesn't really matter.
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 20, 2002 3:34:00 AM
|
|
|
PTupdate.com
Posts: 1490
Joined: October 8, 2001
From: Pittsburgh, PA USA
Status: offline
|
I doubt that occurs. Lie down and put it on yourself, turn it up high, and you will feel that NOTHING is being cancelled out!
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 20, 2002 3:50:00 AM
|
|
|
Andrew M. Ball MS MBA PT
Posts: 271
Joined: September 30, 2001
From: Chapel Hill
Status: offline
|
Agreed.
Sounds like a PT rambling something that he heard once from another PT, thought it sounded good, and imprinted it as fact. Ask him for a reference on this.
If he can't produce one, tell him that it's inappropriate and unprofessional to critique and criticize another therapist on the basis of technician-oriented theory that has no basis in evidence-based fact.
Drew
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 20, 2002 6:35:00 AM
|
|
|
Bournephysio
Posts: 586
Joined: April 25, 2002
From: Calgary
Status: offline
|
Come to think of it I don't think that the theory behind ifc is right. If the electrodes are crossing at 90 degrees and the current goes straight from one electrode to the other, there will be no interference. It has to rely on current taking a non direct path. This will have to be at a significant angle since interference will be related to the cosine of the angle of intersection (0 at 90 degrees).
Anyone know any research on how the body conducts electricity?
Doug
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 20, 2002 9:45:00 AM
|
|
|
Bobcat
Posts: 493
Joined: July 13, 1999
Status: offline
|
bournephysio...
please note that electric current is a scalar representation of charged particle flow and is not compatible with vector representations in a specified field
thank you for invoking engineering terminology however
aussies rule
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 20, 2002 11:36:00 AM
|
|
|
Bournephysio
Posts: 586
Joined: April 25, 2002
From: Calgary
Status: offline
|
Thanks Bobcat,
Just talked to one of the engineering grad students in the lab who did some electrical. Now I'm even more confused. I think I'll stick to biomechanics.
I still don't think it matters for tens.
The engineering terminology did sound pretty authoritative. Maybe I should become a electromodality guru. It doesn't have to be correct does it. [IMG]http://www.rehabedge.com/forums/smile.gif[/IMG]
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 20, 2002 4:26:00 PM
|
|
|
sarty
Posts: 65
Joined: April 22, 2001
From: Florida, USA
Status: offline
|
Thanks everyone for answering me [IMG]http://www.rehabedge.com/forums/smile.gif[/IMG] It makes me feel a lot better knowing I haven't been doing this wrong for the past 8 years!
After I posted this, I emailed a friend of mind who is a PT and he replied with a quote"
the following is from "Therapeutic Modalities in
Sports Medicine" by William Prentice, 1990, pg 70-71. "...TENS uses
similar-sized electrodes placed according to a pattern and moved in a
trial-and-error pattern until pain is decreased. The following patterns may
be used:
...
7. Crossing patterns involve eletrode application such that the electrical
signals from each set of electrodes add together at some point in the body
and the intensity accumulates. The electrodes are usually in a criss-cross
pattern around the point to be stimulated (fig. 4-16).
...which confirms what all of you have said.
The PT who said I was doing it wrong is, unfortunately, prone to coming up with statements like that. Just this Monday, he subbed in my pool class and told them I had been teaching them incorrectly. Growl, lol. I'm not really sure how to approach him about it.
|
|
|
|
|
Re: TENS electrode placement - June 21, 2002 11:30:00 AM
|
|
|
jma
Posts: 2432
Joined: August 24, 2000
From: NY
Status: offline
|
Excellent,
You have found some research that confirms what the others have been saying. Instead of getting into a debate, give the PT who told you this information to begin a copy of the article you have and let him/her decide for himself.
|
|
|
|
 New Messages |
 No New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/ New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/o New Messages |
 Locked w/ New Messages |
 Locked w/o New Messages |
|
 Post New Thread
Reply to Message
Post New Poll
Submit Vote
Delete My Own Post
Delete My Own Thread
Rate Posts |
|
0.078
|
Printable Version
