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DPT Costs
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DPT Costs - March 9, 2001 8:10:00 AM
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Dash
Posts: 31
Joined: November 6, 2000
From: Durham, NC
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Hello all. I have been accepted to Duke University's DPT program and I am very concerned about going considering many factors that I have read about in this forum. I am an accountant now and being somewhat numbers oriented I look at my returning to school as an investment of sorts, one that I want a "return" on in the future. Given the nature of PT now and from what I've read here, its frustrating to think that I will have a serious amount of debt from loans that I may or may not be able to afford when I graduate. I don't know a lot about healthcare, etc. but from what I gather it would be a long time before I could afford a home and support a family. I chose the DPT maybe due to more or an idealistic view of healthcare and PT but now that I'm seeing the real world situation I'm not so sure it is going to be worth it. I have heard the advice, go for it u always have this to fall back on or if it will make u happy then do it but I have become very pessimistic. I think mcap gave the advice of getting through school as cheaply as possible and you can always return for post professional education which makes a lot of sense to me. Does anyone feel that a MPT from say UNC its really any different than a DPT from Duke in today's marketplace? I guess I just wanted to rant about this since its been a very hard decision to make so forgive me if its a little much. Any feeback would be appreciated.
Dash
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Re: DPT Costs - March 9, 2001 10:19:00 AM
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johnny appleseed
Posts: 35
Joined: March 5, 2001
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Dash,
i'm sure you have all the tools availible to you but this website has helped me get a handle on the number$ game...especially how much education can cost in the long-term
[URL=http://www.arismls.com/financial/mortgage.asp]http://www.arismls.com/financial/mortgage.asp[/URL]
granted, i might be using this site completely incorrectly but it has given me a long-term idea on how much my payments will be on any kind of loan. FYI, i have found the majority of my classmates completely in the dark when it comes to having a handle on how much their current and past school loans will be costing them...ie 85k debt turns a 40k salary into a 23k one for 10 years.
.02
[This message has been edited by johnny appleseed (edited March 09, 2001).]
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Re: DPT Costs - March 9, 2001 11:24:00 AM
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Dash
Posts: 31
Joined: November 6, 2000
From: Durham, NC
Status: offline
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Thanks for the feedback. I know while I was interviewing one of the students remarked at how he was on full loans and had just bought a new canoe etc. I was amazed.
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Re: DPT Costs - March 11, 2001 4:40:00 PM
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Andrew M. Ball, MS, PT
Posts: 500
Joined: October 8, 1999
From: Chapel Hill, NC, USA
Status: offline
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I live in Chapel Hill, and teach an invited lecture or two there every year. As such, I will say that I'm a little biased, and will not comment on the quality one program over the other. They're both good. In fact, between Duke, Elon, UNC, and the amount of APTA past and current presidents in the area. . . North Carolina offers some of the best PT programs and opportunities for networking in the nation.
I will say however, that examining the situation from the "get the degree cheaply" perspective, that if you're an in-state student, that UNC is regarded as one of the best dollar-values in the country, and not just for physical therapy.
I would however suggest that due to the changing climate of PT, that you consider not the cost of MPT vs. DPT, but the cost of MPT + DScPT (post-professional clinical doctorate), or MPT + PhD.
Drew
[This message has been edited by Andrew M. Ball, MS, PT (edited March 11, 2001).]
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Re: DPT Costs - March 12, 2001 4:19:00 AM
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Dash
Posts: 31
Joined: November 6, 2000
From: Durham, NC
Status: offline
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Thanks for the feedback Andrew. I really want to go for the DPT, but I guess I am just very cautious and concerned about private school loan debt and how that is going to affect my future. I have seen the advice several times that many on this forum are so glad that they are at public universities versus private due to the nature of PT and future so I am currently at a frustrating point.
Dash
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Re: DPT Costs - March 12, 2001 6:52:00 AM
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mcap
Posts: 652
Joined: February 8, 2000
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Dear Dash:
When I was choosing PT school, I had to choose between a private MS, PT program or a public bachelors program (costing about 2,600/year!!!!!!!). I choose the MS program.
The financial implications have been stagering. My loans have significantly impacted my lifestyle. However, I am not unhappy with my decision. I feel that having a master's gives me more options and the reputation of the school has been helpful.
Some things to consider: 1. The difference between a Master's and a bachelors may be more or less than the difference between MPT and DPT - not sure.
2. My Master's program was about 20,000 the first year and about 13,000 for the second. This is substantially cheaper than many private programs.
3. If I had to choose between and excellent MPT or a great DPT program at significantly higher cost, there is no question......I would go for the MPT program. There are so many ways for you to enhance your qualifications and skills after you get your degree. There are distance learning programs and advanced degrees that will enhance your marketability.
4. The cost of a DPT cannot be measured in just additional tuition. A tuition of 20,000 can cost three times as much when you consider interest, fees, lost income for the extra year, living expenses for the extra year, etc.
So there you have it........good luck.
Mcap
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Re: DPT Costs - March 12, 2001 7:09:00 AM
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Dash
Posts: 31
Joined: November 6, 2000
From: Durham, NC
Status: offline
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Thanks for the advice mcap. Does anyone know of any scholarships or other outside sources of aid besides federal loans that are available out there? Also are there any loan forgiveness programs with employers, etc?
Dash
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Re: DPT Costs - March 12, 2001 12:17:00 PM
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Andrew M. Ball, MS, PT
Posts: 500
Joined: October 8, 1999
From: Chapel Hill, NC, USA
Status: offline
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When I was going through school, there was a program in New York that would pay up to 14K per year in return for a year or two of service to the state.
For those who knew that they wanted to do work in developmental centers, or UCP centers, it was a great deal.
PT does not experience the high demand for services that it used too. When I graduated, sign on bonuses of 5K to 10K were quite common. No mas.
What goes around comes around though. The "Golden Age" of PT is over, and many of the old guard are upset about that. They tend to discourage new PT's from entering the profession, but consider this . . .
The "old guard" has sucessfully created a situation where PT is no longer valued as a prime profession, as it was several years ago. As a result, there is dropping enrollment in PT program. Class sizes have dropped, but faculy size cannot . . . the result is more one-to-one attention. Hopefully the yields a better education.
Also, those who choose to go into PT nowadays, desite the warnings of despair tend to be much more internally driven as a group than my classmates ever were . . . many of whom would admit behind closed doors that they went into PT for the promise of a good salary. When that dried up, many jumped ship instead of working to strengthen the profession. The new crop will not respond the same way, their motivations are different.
Finally, because there are so few people trying to go to PT schools nowadays . . . when you graduate, you can expect an increased demand for PT than is seen today . . . provided that we continue to demontrate positive outcomes.
Let me know when and if you come to visit the Triangle, I'd love to get together for lunch and discuss this further . . . off the record of course!
Drew
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Re: DPT Costs - March 12, 2001 12:58:00 PM
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Dash
Posts: 31
Joined: November 6, 2000
From: Durham, NC
Status: offline
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Thanks again Drew for your comments. I really feel that I am internally driven and the money isn't my primary motivator. However, I just want to make sure I can live and support a family on the effective salary I will earn with loan payments. It seems that a lot of the more experienced therapists are really down on recommending the field to anyone, but I feel that there are some good changes that are to come and I would love to be a part of it. If I accept my offer from Duke I'll look ya up in August and would like to discuss it further. Thanks again.
Dash
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Re: DPT Costs - March 15, 2001 4:21:00 AM
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Dash
Posts: 31
Joined: November 6, 2000
From: Durham, NC
Status: offline
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Yes I have volunteered both in an acute rehab setting at a local hospital and at a sports med rehab center to get some exposure to the field. One of the guys I worked with at the sports med center remarked that he was a little frustrated with the income potential and if he did it over he would have probably went to chiropractic school. It was an interesting experience and several of the more experienced therapists were not exactly excited about the DPT but some of the newer graduates were supportive.
Dash
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Re: DPT Costs - March 15, 2001 8:28:00 AM
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SamCopp
Posts: 10
Joined: January 31, 2000
From: Bolivar, MO. USA
Status: offline
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Dear Dash:
I was in your position when the decision for me to pursue an MPT vs. a BS was in vogue. I am glad that I chose the MPT route. It gave me a few more options-teaching at a PTA program or being an ACCE at an MPT program level. I think that you should go with whatever the association is advising for the future-the DPT is now in full gear since the vision statement and goals were issued this year. I do not necessarily agree with the DPT for current situations and most PT's who I speak to in clinic are not in favor of it. But,it is going to become a reality and we may as well get adjusted to it for the future's sake.
Regarding loan repayment, I had about 20K in loans and have spread it out over 15-20 years, pay extra on it and have only a $200/mo. payment. this has not hinderedus too much as a family and I am the sole wage earner. There are other ways to get the loan repaid-such as working for the Public Health Service in underserved areas like out west. For as long as you work for them, they pick up the monthly payment.
I think the same way that you do and wish to keep the debt down. One noted author, Larry Burkett, says that there are two things worth going into debt over: home and education. You just have to manage it right and keep it at a minimum by good planning. One friend of mine is a clinical psychologist he told me his strategy for grad. school. He took one-half of his IRA acct. and applied it to pay for all of his schooling. He has completed it and is now rebuilding his IRA.
Hope that this helps-
SamCopp, DOCE
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Re: DPT Costs - March 15, 2001 8:42:00 AM
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Dash
Posts: 31
Joined: November 6, 2000
From: Durham, NC
Status: offline
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Thanks for the feedback SamCopp.
Dash
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